Response

Good, nothing better than a nice family argument to bring out the long posts :-) It would be even more fun if more people joined the fray...........

First: For nanna's arugments
Define "Ruin Earth". It is ultimately survival of the fittest. If a species is extinct, let the cause be the crash of a meteor, rising atmospheric temperature or overfishing,the Darwinian process of natural selection is in play.

Building precisely on your point that nature would return, is it beyond the realm of probability to witness the emergence of a species capable of surviving the altered conditions?

In fact, I would argue that it is human hubris to assume we, of all species, are so uniquely designed that we could control the direction and the destiny of the earth by our actions. Just like the undersea bacteria living the near the geothermal vents, we are an insignificant spec in the biodiversity of this planet and are simply performing our role, continuing the natural evolution.

Would it lead to the extermination of the human race and the rise of another super predator? Or to a genetically evolved set of species capable of surviving the next "fire age" similar to the ice age? If billions of Earth's history is any indicator, a single species CANNOT ruin earth.


To Anna's point of Progress or Lack there of:
Was India better 10 years ago than today? Would you trade the "progress for a few" to "progress for none"? The divide between rich and poor is not an Indian phenomenon. It is a HUMAN phenomenon. And believe me, we hear the same rich-poor divide debate EVERYDAY, even in the so-called developed nations.

Capitalism and democracy may not be the ideal solution, but they are the best of all evils. Or an authoritarian society such as China, progressing across all walks of society, at the expense of your rights and liberties, be preferable? And if the ultimate destiny is to end up as US, would an average Indian reject the living conditions in India if they were exactly like US? Would one argue India 20 years ago is better than US today? Is an unemployment rate of 8% as in US, preferable over 15% in France, a socialist country? I am not saying it is the best, I am saying it is the least worst.

And with a history of only 50 years to shape her own destiny, compared to the 400+ years for US and Britain, what is so special about India that it can escape all the growing pains these developed nations went through and chart a completely different path to success? One might argue, India is an ancient civilization with thousands of years of history, but pardon me, the world is not the same it was thousands of years ago. Balance of power always shifts, to the species / race that can adapt to and adopt the current conditions (hello, Mr.Darwin). The once mighty roman empire, the empire on which sun never set, United States and our generation could witness the mantle pass on to China.

I can't recall who said it, but I like this quote, "Remember, you are unique. Just like everyone else."

And coming to the point of consumption, why the human drive to consume, to achieve? What is achievement? Why is it needed?

For animals, the ultimate prize once basic needs such as food and shelter are met, is the right to procreate. Combining one's genes with the choicest genes of the opposing sex. The fittest survive by passing on the gene that makes them successful, whether being the fastest at escaping predators, or being the best at making money, which, in the current phase of human race, is the measure of success. Ultimately, man is but a rational animal. Rational, yes, but still an animal.

And how does one attract the mate of the opposite sex? By showing off assets. Much like a peacock fanning it feathers, he drives a Porsche. She wears a Prada. Or he buys a 4 crore house. But what if you already have a mate? Marriage is a social custom, designed to protect the weak. The ANIMAL is always on the lookout for a better mate, be it the male or female. Even if we give consideration to the marital fidelity, how to instill the drive to evolve, and succeed further, in one's progeny? If you live in a 4 crore house, they might aspire for a 6 crore house. By living in a 2 crore house, they might aspire for only a 4 crore one, already falling behind in the genetic race.

And as the "success gene" is passed on, is it any different from the process of evolution that rich are getting richer? Of course, there are always mutations, such as Bill Gates and Paris Hilton, both for the better and for the worse.

Consumption is driven by evolution.................... As Indians move along the line of evolution, adapting to the current world, they consume.

Yesterday roman orgies, today US consumerism, tomorrow it could be Chinese excesses, but one thing for sure, we would always try to keep up with the Joneses, damn them!!!! But for them, we would all be happy and the earth would be saved. Go forth and destroy all Joneses!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!